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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Topic Author's Original Post - Dec 16, 2014 - 03:20pm PT
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I started this thread because there aree a lot of savvy net/tech/IT people on the Taco Stand. In the past I received better (and simpler) advice and answers from Supertopians than from Apple of other tech forums.
I do not buy much online, mainly pay bills. I think the last thing I bought was book from Amazon about two years ago.
About two weeks ago I was in hospital for six days (good thing Jennie was in respite care in a nursing home, as I am her full-time primary carer).
I get discharged by the doc, get home to check my emails, and then my/our bank account. Whoa, what's this, €109.99? I never bought anything like that. I keep most receipts for warranty or guarantee purposes, or for large amounts (to me on a Carer's Allowance €109 is a lot) check my eStatements back to August.
Was I phished?
I contacted the bank's Financial Crime Prevention Unit, they looked into it, actually the funds were not taken online, it was my debit card that was used. Not that I am naive about how clever some of these cyber crooks are, but I asked, "How did they get my card number and even more so my PIN?"
I may occasionally want to buy something online in the future, for example, as I was in the Gardai (police) station reporting it formally and having them sign the form the bank sent me, somebody smashed my left (passenger, remember Ireland is right hand side drive) my side view mirror (narrow street and a 2002 VW Polo doesn't automatically fold in the mirrors, and I didn't).
The mechanic I use cannot find a second-hand one, so I guess shell out for a new one, but my landlord suggested I try eBay (never used it before).
Now after that long-winded babble above. What is the safest and securest (if there is such a thing, these cyber crooks always seem to be one step ahead)? PayPal, for example?
Advice please.
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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Dec 16, 2014 - 03:47pm PT
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I like PayPal because all your financial info is shielded from the transaction--the person you pay sees only that you're paying with PayPal; you choose what bank account/credit card/debit card you want to use for the transaction behind the scenes.
As long as PayPal doesn't get hacked, your financial "instruments" are safe.
At least that's why I use it.
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Dec 16, 2014 - 03:53pm PT
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Best to use a credit card, much more consumer protection with them. I use a credit card, build up rewards points, pay the balance and get cash from the credit card company.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Dec 16, 2014 - 03:54pm PT
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" it was my debit card that was used."
I've been moving away from debit card use for ANY type of purchases for these reasons. Here in the States, debit cards don't have the same consumer protection that credit cards do- if your debit card gets hacked into your checking account, it can take months (if ever) for the banks to refund it.
No idea what the consumer protection laws are outside the US around credit card use, but if they are similar, I'd suggest getting one. It's been the 'year of the hack', and it's only getting worse...and consumers are sure to get the short end of the stick.
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labrat
Trad climber
Auburn, CA
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Dec 16, 2014 - 03:56pm PT
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PayPal with my credit card..... Best of both worlds ;-)
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Dec 16, 2014 - 05:11pm PT
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"credit cards offer protections that debit cards don't(and a personal debit card has protections that a business debit does not)"
Do you have a good source that succinctly defines business debit (or credit) protections vs. consumer protections? Consumer credit card consumer protections are pretty well known, but I've yet to find the same clarity regarding business card protections.
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WBraun
climber
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Dec 16, 2014 - 06:12pm PT
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Sign up with "Bank of ISIS".
If someone steals from you they will chop of their heads.
Ho mannnn .....
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JonA
Trad climber
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Dec 16, 2014 - 06:17pm PT
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Sign up with "Bank of ISIS".
If someone steals from you they will chop of their heads.
Multiple headed thieves are the worst.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Topic Author's Reply - Dec 17, 2014 - 04:09am PT
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Thanks, some good advice. I will use PayPal when and if necessary, using my debit card, as the bank and credit card companies will not issue me a credit card as I am not employed. What the hell do they call a full-time caregiver, a loafer? Okay, €204/week Carer's Allowance is not a lot, but I can't even get an overdraft, because I do not "meet the criteria".
So when I do go overdrawn, and I do, I get nailed by the bank with fees and charges.
Oh sure, when I was on €51,000 year after tax as a journalist up in Dublin, no problems with getting a credit card or an overdraft.
What's eBay like?
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Happiegrrrl2
Trad climber
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Dec 17, 2014 - 01:19pm PT
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Do you have a good source that succinctly defines business debit (or credit) protections vs. consumer protections?
When I opened my business account many years ago, the banker explained the differences(the one thing I clearly recall being that they are NOT legally obliged to replenish funds which were defrauded, though the one time this happened to me, they did do so). Also, fees incurred to a business account are tax deductible, whereas personal account fees are not. I would suggest, if this information is important for you, to go speak in person with your banker.
RE: How's Ebay?
Paying through PayPal on Ebay offers you protection, but there ARE scammers on EBay. For one thing, people who purchase stolen credit card information often hire people to take the made up cards to stores and purchase expensive items such as electronics of designer fashion goods. They have another person who sells those items via online sites such as EBay stores(or local street fairs/flea markets). That is how they launder the funds.
Some scammers also set up stores and then never ship the goods, or contact you with some variation of a scam in order to get your information so they can drain your account.
So - consider that the "too good to be true" item online is likely illegitimately obtained, or possibly that it doesn't even exist.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Dec 17, 2014 - 01:24pm PT
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"...if this information is important for you, to go speak in person with your banker."
Yeah, I've considered that, except for one major problem: that would be Bank of America, the single shittiest bank in the world, which I'm stuck with for reasons beyond this discussion.
I don't trust for a second anything that one of their representatives would tell me about this question- not that I suspect they'd lie, but more that they simply don't know the laws themselves, and any kind of answer they might try to dig up would be aimed at making me happy & keeping me as a customer.
I've heard similar understandings of the business protections laws from other individuals, but have been on the lookout for some kind of clear legal documentation of it.
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Happiegrrrl2
Trad climber
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Dec 17, 2014 - 02:18pm PT
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I have BoA (Bank operated by Azzholes?) too, and agree with your sentiments. BITD when they were running the cascading fees scam, the customer service reps absolutely seemed to have no idea what was occurring. This summer, there was a (brief) relapse into the behavior, and when I went in to complain, the rep tried to "help me solve the problem," by suggesting I apply for a BoA credit line. Infuriating.
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