Valdez, Keystone Canyon DAMALANCHE! (awesome video)

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Messages 1 - 20 of total 49 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Cragman

Trad climber
June Lake, California....via the Damascus Road
Topic Author's Original Post - Feb 1, 2014 - 03:40am PT


http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=999_1391126821
WTF

climber
Feb 1, 2014 - 05:15am PT
Time to get out the bunker busters. Wow.
eKat

Trad climber
Less than a second shy of 49 minutes
Feb 1, 2014 - 05:36am PT
WhoaNelly. . . that road is scary enough without being ravaged by an avalanche!

YIKES!

P.S. They must have a huge road crew if it will only take them 3 days to clean that up!
TwistedCrank

climber
Bungwater Hollow, Ida-ho
Feb 1, 2014 - 06:34am PT
They should have just salted the road to begin with. Christ.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HBRKRNH
Feb 1, 2014 - 08:06am PT
that looks cold for the palm trees i hear the p bears are lounging under up there..
Jim Clipper

climber
from: forests to tree farms
Feb 1, 2014 - 08:42am PT
I remember a geology teacher saying that something similar happened during the last ice age, somewhere on the Snake River? I think they have found debris along the Columbia river gorge about 500ft. up? Native Americans were likely in the area to witness the ice dam breaking. Cool to see one, no pun intended.

found a link:

http://hugefloods.com/

Having seen potholes in granite, check out the picture of the pothole in the link.
eKat

Trad climber
Less than a second shy of 49 minutes
Feb 1, 2014 - 08:52am PT
Yeah. . . the big Lake Missoula Flood that roared down the Columbia River Gorge was a trip! You can see the high water marks of the glacial lake above the town of Missoula.
kaholatingtong

Trad climber
Nevada City
Feb 1, 2014 - 09:06am PT
and so a new lake was created just like that. and they always taught us geologic processes are so slow and gradual ...
TwistedCrank

climber
Bungwater Hollow, Ida-ho
Feb 1, 2014 - 09:06am PT
The Lake Bonneville flood was twice as big as the Glacial Lake Missoula flood.

Geologic time is best described as extended periods of boredom interrupted by brief periods of terror.
eKat

Trad climber
Less than a second shy of 49 minutes
Feb 1, 2014 - 09:18am PT

and so a new lake was created just like that. and they always taught us geologic processes are so slow and gradual ...

Yeah. . . water enters the picture and everything changes!

Geologic time is best described as extended periods of boredom interrupted by brief periods of terror.

Indeed!

:-)
klk

Trad climber
cali
Feb 1, 2014 - 09:36am PT
Geologic time is best described as extended periods of boredom interrupted by brief periods of terror.

that's what working at the refinery was like
eKat

Trad climber
Less than a second shy of 49 minutes
Feb 1, 2014 - 09:49am PT
http://hugefloods.com/

Jim Clipper. . . TFPU!

That site is REALLY, REALLY COOL!

:-)
bhilden

Trad climber
Mountain View, CA/Boulder, CO
Feb 1, 2014 - 10:03am PT
I have a friend who lives in the canyon above the avalanche. She was almost flooded out because of the river backing up after the avalanche. The water was rising about 30 feet an hour up the road. Yikes!
BJ

climber
Feb 1, 2014 - 11:23am PT
The Lake Bonneville flood was twice as big as the Glacial Lake Missoula flood.

Not really. The volume of water impounded in Lake Bonneville was about twice as large as the volume of the various Lake Missoula's. But Lake Missoula drained in less than a week, while Lake Bonneville probably took in excess of a month to drain. Consequently, the majority of the Bonneville floods were contained to the regions around the Snake and Columbia, the Missoula floodwaters were impounded at Walula Gap and other structural constrictions and formed temporary lakes of some depth. For instance, Lake Lewis covered the Tri Cities with about 800' of water.

There certainly could have been transient lakes formed by the impoundment of Bonneville waters, but certainly not on the scale of Missoula

Jim O'Connor of the USGS has worked extensively on Lake Bonneville, as has Richard Waitt, who are both featured on Central Rocks.

As an aside, Jack Powell is a long time E-burg'er, and a climbing partner of the Freds (Stanley and Dunham) as well as the late Barry Prather of Everest '63 and the Praters (the late Gene and Bill) of 50's and 60's Cascade climbing and snowshoe fame. And Robert Bentley is one of a kind.

Credit: wiki
http://www.geology.cwu.edu/centralrocks/
Jim Clipper

climber
from: forests to tree farms
Feb 1, 2014 - 02:50pm PT
Very cool connection ^
BJ

climber
Feb 2, 2014 - 06:42am PT
and so a new lake was created just like that. and they always taught us geologic processes are so slow and gradual ...

They taught you right.

Most geologic processes are gradual and slow, that's how we got Mount Everest, the Grand Canyon and the Western Cordilleran. Remember, this weeny teeny little temporary lake near Valdez can't be used as much of a geologic example of anything, much less some refutation of Hutton.

Even the Missoula floods, which had a flow greater than all the rivers now on earth, affected only the surface of a small region of North America. At present, only bolide strikes and super volcanoes have been recognized as geologic neo-catrostrophic events of more than regional importance.

Those and Noah's floods of coarse.
clinker

Trad climber
California
Feb 2, 2014 - 08:04am PT
Hey you rock-hounds with satellites orbiting in space, it's not to late.
Repent! Repent!

A slide on Bubbs Creek caused the same backup on a smaller scale in 1983? We could see the high water marks, branches ripped off trees and debris at a height far above any imaginable flood stage of the river. Eventually we came to the slide that had come off the Charlotte Dome side of the canyon and blocked the water flow. I wouldn't want to be downstream of one of those babies when they blow.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Feb 2, 2014 - 08:17am PT
The good thing is that usually a damn caused by snow or ice avalanche dosn't blow catastrophically.
the usual thing is a drainage channel erodes immediately and proves adequate in maintaining a steady release of water. If you look at the broad mass of the deposit in Valdez it seems likely that that is the case there. I still wouldn't send a crew in there to start sawing the branch off while sitting on it but in all likelyhood they new lake will sit still until the channel erodes gradually to a volume that drains it over time.

The catastrophic failures are know as a Jokulup, a norwegian term that describes big failures of glacier ice that release huge floods of water. Its a different dynamic and relatively rare, and I've never heard of one yet that involved an avalanche deposit. I still wouldn't want to set up a camp there.



here is a similar problem, perhaps relevant to the valdez lake:



At the risk of being an obnoxious nag, I think it is worth pointing out that perhaps the most significant observation about this event and the ones in the videos is the relationship to the warming climate. The Alaska event was a direct result of the wild swings of weather extremes they have experienced this season. Cold and dry followed by plenty of snow, followed by massive and prolonged warming. Not unheard of but the extremes experienced are what has been forecast for the future, resulting in extreme catastrophic events that occur on a return cycle no one has planned for.

Similarly, the glacier ice hazards elsewhere may become more probable.
BJ

climber
Feb 2, 2014 - 08:56am PT
I think it is worth pointing out that perhaps the most significant observation about this event and the ones in the videos is the relationship to the warming climate. The Alaska event was a direct result of the wild swings of weather extremes they have experienced this season

To correlate these events with global warming is a stretch. They (the dams) are probably normal events in periglacial, arctic and alpine areas. They can happen regardless of the greater global climate
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Feb 2, 2014 - 09:09am PT
Of course. One cannot ascribe a single event to climate change. I did not say that exactly and I think interpreting such examples that way is misleading. As I stated, these events are examples of extremes that are forecast to occur more often than we are used to. We are not experienced with accounting for extreme hazards in engineering our infrastructure on return periods that are probably going to increase in frequency.

This is a very significant issue. We do account for losses, but the cost / benefit / risk is directly related to return periods. Just ask any insurance provider. A rapid increase in frequency of events, not just avalanches but drought, flood, beetle killed forest, loss of fish stocks and a host of other issues. Lets just be happy that the Valdez oil pipeline was not involved somehow. This is one of the greatest hazard potentials regarding the Enbridge Tarsands pipeline proposed to run through the coast mountains of BC, threatening one of the remaining significant Sockeye runs in north America. There is some talk of the hazard but it is not, in my estimation, emphasized enough.
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