the albatross
Gym climber
Flagstaff
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Topic Author's Original Post - Dec 6, 2012 - 01:33pm PT
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The Navajo Nation is proposing a massive tourist development which includes a Gondola to the confluence of the Colorado and LIttle Colorado Rivers. If you have ever been there you know (hopefully) it is a special place. The development is in the midst of the main canyon and within spitting distance of some very sacred sites for some cultures.
Here is some info from the website:
"Grand Canyon Escalade’s main draw would be the “Escalade” Gondola Tramway, carrying tourists from the Grand Canyon’s South Rim to the Canyon floor. Once there, visitors could walk along a 1,400-foot elevated river walk to the confluence, eat at a restaurant, or visit an amphitheater and terraced grass seating area overlooking the Colorado River. The development would also include a Navajo cultural center and retail and art galleries. Publicity materials claim the project will yield 2,000 jobs at full build-out and generate $50 to $95 million annually for the Navajo Nation. Navajo grassroots activists and neighbors of the project say local attitudes about it are sharply divided, creating tension in the community and pitting neighbors against one another. Several members of one grassroots group formed to oppose Escalade marched last week from the confluence to Navajo governmental offices in Window Rock, to make their opposition known." [Around a 100 mile hike]
Here is a link to a site with more info:
http://savetheconfluence.com/opposition-continues-for-the-grand-canyon-escalade/#more-997
I have no affiliation with this group, just wanted to raise some awareness.
Long live wild places.
Albert Newman
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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That sounds swell! Are there plans for a dam near the confluence to facilitate ADA swimming? Golly, I sure hope so.
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labrat
Trad climber
Nevada City, CA
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Wow!
No thank you
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dave Sparrows
Trad climber
AZ
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The way I see it, we took all of their land at one point, so let them do what they want with what little they have left. It will probably be a nice cash influx for the Hualapai people. I mean look what we (the white man) are doing at the Arizona Snow Bowl/ Agassiz Peak; a sacred sight of the Navajo and Hopi people that we now spread human waste (Grey water) on to make snow. I know two wrongs do not make a right, but I say just leave them alone, it is their land to do what they please with it.
EDIT: Misunderstanding- I thought it was the Hualapai not the Navajo with the gondola proposal.
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adrian korosec
climber
Tucson
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Sounds like a great idea! If we could establish a way to pay to climb towers legally too it would be great. The Navajo Nation has every right increase revenue via natural resources provided it's done in a responsible, thought out manner.
I don't get the hatred of making certain wild places more accessible to the masses who otherwise could not enjoy them.
A gondola to the bottom of the Grand Canyon sounds great. A nice restaurant and gift shop at the bottom with mountain hut type lodging would be in order as well.
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Jeremy
Social climber
Albuquerque, NM
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"Albatross",
So if they get this...do we get free reign over all Reservation towers?
Tit for tat?
Hope all is well and you are getting out.
Jeremy Aslaksen
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Dave Kos
Trad climber
Temecula
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Hey, we took all of their land [...]
Who is "we" ?
Who is "they" ?
Those who took and those who were taken from are long dead.
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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I do not believe that the confluence is on tribal land so NPS approval would be required, ain't gonna happen.
Very true Dave, the Navajo pushed out other cultures when they "invaded" North America, ironically around the same time Columbus "discovered" America
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TwistedCrank
climber
Dingleberry Gulch, Ideeho
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Will they serve drinks?
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Jeremy
Social climber
Albuquerque, NM
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FREE THE TOWERS AND SERVE DRINKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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crunch
Social climber
CO
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The way I see it, we took all of their land at one point, so let them do what they want with what little they have left. It will probably be a nice cash influx for the Hualapai people. I mean look what we (the white man) are doing at the Arizona Snow Bowl/ Agassiz Peak; a sacred sight of the Navajo and Hopi people that we now spread human waste (Grey water) on to make snow. I know two wrongs do not make a right, but I say just leave them alone, it is their land to do what they please with it.
hey, david sparrows, it does not work that way. This is anglo developers, and their deep pockets, steamrolling over the Navajos, just like it usually is. The Fulcrum Group LLC, along with Confluence Partners LLC are pushing to develop this Gondola project. Lamar Whitmer is one of the Fulcrum Group. He was treasurer of Snowbowl a few years ago. He lives in Scottsdale, as does his friend Todd Borowsky. Todd's father, Eric Borowsky, owns the Snowbowl resort.
Same people, same developers, same money. They don't give a sh!t about anything except their profits. They have pockets deep enough to ensure that there's some buy in by powerful tribal members (like President Shelly) to keep this thing moving, just as there was back when Peabody pushed for mining coal.
Here:
http://navajotimes.com/news/2012/0412/041712whit.php
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Jebus H Bomz
climber
Reno, Nuh VAAAA duh
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Screwed up. Not everyone has a right to go everywhere. That's why these are special places. Keep the Wild West wild, m'er f'ers!
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Jeremy
Social climber
Albuquerque, NM
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Nice Crusher, and thanks for the info Albert.
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10b4me
Boulder climber
Somewhere on 395
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hey, david sparrows, it does not work that way. This is anglo developers, and their deep pockets, steamrolling over the Navajos, just like it usually is.
I read an article about this a few weeks ago. Crunch is correct. It's the white man pushing it, but he has got the Navajo to buy into it because he is promising jobs. The Hopi are strictly opposed to the idea.
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Jolly Roger
Trad climber
here and there
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The hopi are the only true ancestors of those parts. The navajos are roughly 500 years new.
They got the land becuase they would work with the white man.
Those mountians are not sacred, they are just retarded mooches.
Ask any hopi
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bigwall shitter
Social climber
the wild west
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that confluence is one of the coolest places around, swimming in the warm aquamarine blue waters of the Little C wearing yer birthday suit in full view of the old folks from illinois bumbling down the boardwalk.
Go ahead and build!
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Riley Wyna
Trad climber
A crack near you
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Ya.. the white man paves, pollutes and kills 99 percent of the north American ecosystem..But the Indian wants to build a Gondola and suddenly the Indian is desecrating holy places...
Bahahahaha
I fear....soon all the Buffalo will be gone too!
Stupid white idiots..
Edit: white men steam rolling the natives into this?
Like I said...greedy stupid white man...
Either way I stand with the native people....maybe its Donald Trump - I'll be glad to help scalp him and what ever the hell that thing in his head is...
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Gene
climber
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Maybe they could put in an oyster farm as well.
g
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deuce4
climber
Hobart, Australia
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^^^
Actually, it was the Hopi who were peaceful and worked with the early settlers in the region. The Navajo resisted, were forcibly re-located, but eventually signed a peace treaty and were allowed to return.
But the Hopi, who cooperated with USA's "manifest destiny" and didn't fight, never got a treaty, and ever since have seen their tribal lands diminish (and bit by bit, it still continues to diminish).
See http://www.viewzone.com/day6.html for a map.
The current reality is that the Navajo are politically organised and comprise a sizeable voting population in the four corners region. Both tribes are wonderful people, but the Navajo ended up with the better end of white man's deal, to be certain.
Not sure how I feel about the tramway. It's a beautiful area, and increased access will expose many to the beauty of the Southwest. I've spent a lot of time in that area, it's tough to get down there, and I'd be hard pressed to say that only the rugged individual can visit. Of course there will be impact from a tramway, but in this day and age, economic benefit that's dependent on natural environmental beauty, rather than involving its destruction, might be the better way forward in general. There are those who still would be calling for more dams on the Colorado, most likely, if it weren't for the significant commercialisation of the river running industry.
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